Thundercat's Seduction Lair

Kiss Me, Kill Bill...

Kill Bill Vol. 2 is coming out today. I am psyched!!!! I loved Vol. 1 (it also gave me one of my WORST routines ever. 100% field rejected, but it taught me alot =)

I hear this one is going to be less "action" and more "Cool Tarantino dialogue" oriented. Everyone I've heard from who's seen it has told me it's better than the first one, so I think I'm in for a treat.

How does this relate to Pick-Up? It doesn't. Slow news day. =)

Cutting through the bullshit

Lifeforce had a really excellent post over on the Don Juan message boards about a paradime shift he had in his way of thinking, that I feel might be something that others who study this stuff may eventually go through at some point in their development. Its a bit of a touchy-feely post, but I think it hits a few fundamental points that should be addressed.

Lifeforce writes:
I have read 48 laws of power, psycho cybernetics, the art of seduction, the DJ bible, went through almost the entire fastseduction, read alot of psychology, influence books, seminars, Secrets of SS, read advanced macking, david d'angelo, read a lot from this site, how to get any women you desire into bed, etc... etc... etc...

Have I had any use of this? Mostly not, mostly it was just wasted knowledge that stung a dagger into the soul. Some things are just not meant to be understood but lived. Love is one of those things.

Before I was a guy fixated by tips and fancy techniques to use. I had some success with these techniques, but in the end I realized that I was not using the techniques do anything good. I met women, yes, I had success, yes, but every time I interacted with a woman I was on defcon 1, full alert and my army stuffed into landing crafts ready for invasion. Living for tips and tricks just sucked after a while, it took the fun out of my life, it took out the MAGIC of love and forced me to focus on the techniques and thus STAY COLD. How are you when you are out macking?

So I started to think why! WHY! Why am I doing this? Why am I sacrificing my happiness? What is the goal of all of this? To become successful with women was my first answer, then I realized that that was not it, I wanted to become successful to show that I was a man to others while the one thing I wanted was not ONS it was a relationship with a women I could love. I realised that I lived my life for others and that my life was nothing more than skirt-chasing and trying to please women. That shook my foundations to the last stone.

The primary thing I missed in my life was not women, and every women in the world couldn't change that. The one thing I missed was true happiness. All the time I had been chasing girls I had been chasing some illusion that I would become happy if I slept with 1000 girls, while neglecting the rest of my life and focusing everything on women. And I guess there are more players out there who think that sleeping with the world will give happiness. No that is just not true. That's just being afraid.

I noticed as I abandoned the tricks and manipulations and focused on other areas of my life (the last two months), improving myself I got more positive response from women. When I didn't try to seduce them they was more interrested. When I didn't try to seduce them and was happy and lived a good life women gave me more interrest. It was just more fun!

I had never before understood what pook had written and I had always disliked his way of thinking. But I realized that most of what he said was dead-on. Living with manipulations and tricks just make you unhappy in the end. It is not a life, it is a slavery to women. (and I see that the boards are flourishing with tricks and techniques) All techniques you need will come naturally when you feel good and are in sync with yourself. Around you there is a bubble of your soul which people in your vicinity feel. If it is filled with happiness and overly content of life, people will like you. And the more satisified your life is, the more people will flock to you because they to want to feel happiness. Let go of all the techniques and just listen to yourself and what you feel. The ultimate seducer is not found in any seduction book, it is found within yourself, without thinking about it. Free your mind, don't change your personality.

So why seduce women for the sake of it and tell the results to get some cheering? So you slept with ten women this week? So what! Are you happy? Deep down, are you feeling that you are going somewhere. If you died now, would your life have had any meaning? The winner is the one who dies with a smile on his lips and had a eventful life, the loser is the one who think he is a winner when he isn't happy and never accomplished anything he set out for other than sleeping with half the world. Live for the moment, don't think all the time; feel, be the man, be happy and never look back.

I myself have been thinking about topics like this lately, since I am taking a slight break from sarging at the moment (mostly due to financial reasons). When you step back from learning every single bell and whistle available to you, you really do start to ask yourself the question "Why am I doing this?" Sometimes I wonder if I'm just making everything WAY too complicated. Surely, guys who don't use this stuff still get laid, right?

The thing is, it's easy to lose focus when you're learning this shit, especially if you're involved in the internet scene heavily as I have become through the course of just doing the blog. At some point, it stops being about what it started out to be (trying to get a girlfriend, improve your life, etc), and starts being a popularity contest where you're trying to get the approval of men as opposed to women, which is a wierd phenomenon.

Most of my life, I've pined for girls I felt I could never have, and learning much of what this community has to offer has helped me to take some measure of control over that part of my life. But I do think there comes a time where you have to take a step back and re-evaluate your process and determine whether or not what you're doing is right.

I've met a lot of girls lately. I've got three in particular I'm working at the moment. Maybe that's making me lazy. I don't know. But I do know that I feel I've strayed slightly from my original goal, and it's posts like the one Lifeforce wrote that help me to see that.

I'm wondering if there are others out there who feel the same way and have gone through this type of thing where they just abandoned all they learned and ended up doing better than before? I'd be interested in hearing their thoughts on it.

What's up with Mailbags?

You know, I check out a lot of sites that have to do with dating and seduction for my daily reading. I enjoy the message boards the most because they all have such a varied and different perspective on things, and those are usually the places where the best material is found.

Then you got the other sites with untold Dating Guru's writing article after article. But the thing is, they aren't really articles. They're mailbags.

Most people in the community know what mailbags are, thanks to David DeAngelo and his infamous newsletters. Mailbags are when people write in to the Guru of their choice, asking for help, and then said Guru responds. The thing is, as I look around the internet, all I seem to find is mailbag after mailbag of advice when it comes to dating.

So my queston is: What good is this to me?

Mailbags are usually so personalized to the person who's writing in, that any advice the Guru could share ceases to be of any real use to anyone other than the person who originally wrote them. I guess this is the "Dear Abbey" school of thought where she actually made a CAREER of publishing people's letters in the newspaper and giving them watered down "feel good" advice.

The thing is, back when Dear Abbey started, there was no one around who did that. It was novel to get to see your letter in the paper along with some advice from a so-called "expert." But with the advent of the Internet, information and advice from people MUCH MORE experienced and qualified to help with problems is right at your fingertips.

So why do we still need mailbags?

I personally never read mailbags, because frankly, I've read enough of them to know that there's little, if any good advice to be gained from doing so. At least people like David D., Mystery, and Swinggcat send out essays every now and then. THOSE I get a lot from. But these other people... well, it's just busy work. It's just loads upon loads of crap they churn out to try and get their name on Askmen.com or something.

The thing is, I look at mailbags as laziness at it's finest. Rather than sit around and develop new theories and ideas, or maybe even talk about real life field experience, the "Love Doctors" would rather rev-up their armchairs and answer questions from the clueless masses about all sorts of useless crap that hardly helps the people who's letters they are answering, let alone anyone else.

Is this just me? Am I the only one who doesn't like mailbags? Maybe I'm missing something, I don't know. But I'd personally rather read the longest, most spastic and hap-hazard Tyler post than your average mailbag.

Easter Dinner with AFCs

You know, learning a lot of these PUA tactics really takes a toll on you. It's very much like the movie Fight Club, where the real world gets the volume turned down and you begin to see and respond to the world in a different light. Lately, I've been spending a lot of time with my friends in the community, guys who study this Pick-UP stuff almost as voraciously as I do (and some who study it WAY more than I do). And when you're in that reality, where a typical night is spent breaking down EVERY SINGLE interaction you had with people, you begin to believe that you've figured out certain things about how society REALLY is, and how completely clueless other people are.

This last Sunday, I had dinner with really two good friends of mine. One is my best friend from high school. The other is a good friend from college. They both know each other through me, and became good friends, so it was the three of us just haning out. Of course, neither of these guys know anything about the Pick-Up Arts, or that I do this stuff in my spare time either. But they both have known me long enough that they know the OLD me. The bitter, fat cuss who resented women, and would be way too shy to talk to girls. The typical AFC.

This Sunday, when we went to enjoy Easter Dinner together, was a very surreal experience for me. It was like my reality had changed and completely left theirs behind. I approached something like 7 women while I was with these guys, all of them hot, and they would just stand there and watch as I interacted with these girls on a level they probably have never witnessed before in their lives (and I'm not even that GOOD with this stuff yet! lol).

They kept talking about how much I've changed. They were complimenting me on my look, my dress, my outging nature... they told me I was so "Hollywood," which I guess is as good a compliment as any, seeing as how I love this town. But the wierd thing is that I never noticed how BETA my friends were before. I was doing a lot fo frame control in the group, kind-of laying out what the day was going to be, controlling the conversation, making them qualify to me a bit. It's amazing to see how most guys respond to these tactics, because with a strong enough frame, you can get guys to do the same thing you can get chicks to do when it comes to taking a strong lead.

I've noticed this at work as well. My coworkers will often just do what they're told, even by a subordinate like me, if someone says something with enough authority.

I guess it's just interesting to me how these skills can really change you in ways you never expected. I still like my friends and have a good time when I go out with them, but it's a VERY different feeling than it used to be.

The Dark Side of AMOGs

You know, I think one of the greatest advancements in this Pick-up stuff recently has been the addition of AMOG (Alpha Male Other Guy) tactics. It's such an important thing to know how to do, because inevitably, you're going to be engaged in a set that involves men who are in competition to get your targets.

One thing I'm often asked about AMOG tactics are by guys who are afraid of getting in fights with other guys. The fact of the matter is, most guys don't want to fight. They're as afraid of getting fucked up as you are, and for the most part, people are civilized and would rather move on and have a good time than ruin everyone's night by causing a scene. So for the most part, AMOGing is a rather peaceful and effective tactic.

But there are those occasions where the guy you're AMOGing is such a braindead macho shitbag, that his instinct to throw down overpowers all logical and social reason, that he's going to want to fight you. This is what happened to me last night.

I was basically out at a club with some friends of mine, and a girl comes up to my buddy (he had opened her earlier in the night) and starts talking to him. I see she's with a guy, some fuckin' Argentinian gangbanger who's got a distinct "drug dealer" vibe to him. You know the type -- decked out in Urban Outfitter wear, with a gold chain, and a greasy goatee with a whisp of a mustache like he hasn't fully reached puberty yet. And he's sitting at his table, eyeing my buddy like he's the anti-christ, stewing in his own anger at the fact that the girl he's with isn't into him.

So he gets to his feet and tries to step up to my friend with the pattented:

"Oh, what? You're like a player, motherfucker? You trying to move in on my woman?"

Of course the girl tries to keep him at bay, and like a good PUA, my buddy agrees with him, saying "Dude, you're so right. You're so smart and observant. But I could never compete with you, bro. You're a much better man than I am."

Of course, this guy's synapses stopped firing long ago, so anything my buddy said would only make him angrier. He started saying stuff like "You wanna step to this?" or "C'mon bitch. Let's take this outside."

I stepped in and tried to help by telling my friend "Oh, dude, this guy's too tough. He'll kick your ass. Best let it go, he'll drive you into the ground."

Of course, this only enraged the moron more, but now he was fixated on me. He started calling me a "fucking skinhead" and trying to start shit, even though I'm about 5 inches taller than him and outweigh the featherweight by a good 100 lbs.

Security ended up stepping in as he started trying to lay his hands on me and my buddy. But the security at the club was so fuckin' stupid they didn't kick the guy out, and he kept following me around trying to start shit. Eventually, his buddy (who was on parole, by the way) had to drag him away to keep the police from getting involved because it looked like things were gonna come to blows.

The thing is, I think most guys need to be ready for this type of situation. I've taken martial arts in the past, and knowing how to defend yourself is definitely a plus. Knowing when to walk away is good, but if it's a case like this where the guys is ACTIVELY trying to fight you, it's best to stand your ground and be ready to fight.

There are a few things that I think are important to do in these situations:

1. Never turn your back on an aggressive AMOG.
2. Never break eye contact with the AMOG.
3. Position your body so you look like you're ready to fight.
4. Do not say a single fucking word.

Let me expound on these points a bit...

Point 1: Never turn your back on an aggressive AMOG. Most guys who want to fight you are, deep down, insecure little cowards who feel the only way to recover their self-esteem is to use physical violence. These guys are not smart, they are not proud, and they are certainly NOT brave. If you turn your back on them, they WILL sucker-punch you. And they WILL take advantage of your weakened state. If you have to get away from a beliggerent AMOG, back away slowly as you face him, and only turn when you are a sufficient distance away. But even then, don't let him out of your sight.

Point 2: Never break eye contact with the AMOG. Holding eye contact is a powerful thing. Some guys may take it as a sign of provocation, but by breaking eye contact, you only enbolden the AMOG to fight you, because he'll pick up on it as a sign of weakness, and any sign of weakness will make him think he can win a fight. By keeping eye contact, you will create doubt in his mind and make him think twice about escalating things.

Point 3: Position your body so you look like you're ready to fight. This doesn't mean "Put your fists up." It means angle your body so your shoulder is facing the AMOG, and your standing at a 90 degree angle to him. This gives him the smallest possible target at which to strike, should he throw a blow. Put the hand closest to the AMOG up, guarding your solar plexus region. This is so that it's in a position to block any blow he throws. With your other hand, cock it at the crux of your waist, so it's ready to strike out in retaliation. This not only puts you in a position to defend yourself, but anyone who sees you standing that way (including the AMOG's sober friends) will know you know how to fight and the dude you're squaring off with is about to get creamed. They will usually step in just to save their friend from serious injury.

Point 4: Don't say a single fucking word. This is important, because with brain surgeons like these, ANYTHING you say will be a provocation. Silence can be more unnerving than words. So being completely quiet, when coupled with eye contact and correct body stance, WILL intimidate your opponant, because you are giving them nothing to feed off of. This will eventually create doubt and uncertaintly in them. Remember -- you're trying to avoid a fight here, so don't say a single thing that'll fan the flames.

But dispite all this, AMOG tactics ARE good to know and to use. Just pull out your inner boy scout when you use them and always be prepared.

Girl Humor

You know, I find it interesting how easily ammused most girls can be. I can remember when I was a little kid, I used to go to a barber, who was a pretty attractive woman, to get my hair cut. And while she was cutting my hair, she'd tell all these lame-ass jokes. And she loved me because I knew a bunch of lame-ass jokes too, which were really cutting edge in the 3rd grade, you know? But it seems most girls continue to love this level of humor. Maybe it's their maternal instinct to love all things that are somewhat juvenile, I don't know. But I do know it's an interesting phenomenon that I've been capitalizing on a lot lately.

One of my favorite openers to use is the Gay Cow Opener, which is a form of a Joke Opener (if you don't know what that is, it's in my book the Art of Approaching, along with other examples of Joke Openers). I used it about four times tonight on various different women, and a funny thing happened... they started telling ME jokes. And the thing is, the jokes were just as bad, if not WORSE than the Gay Cow joke, yet the girl's all LOVED them.

I think these silly jokes are a form of chick crack, as Tyler puts it. Simply telling a stupid, simple joke will quickly engage a girl, make her laugh, and get her to try and match you with a semi-funny quip. I'm thinking about maybe next time this happens just looking at her with a dead stare and saying "That's not funny," or something to see how she reacts. Might be a good way to get her to qualify to me. Who knows?

Anyway, just to give you an idea, here's just a sample of Girl Humor, which I got from one of my targets tonight:

What do you call a Gay Dinosaur? A Dino-sore-ass.

Is it any wonder why we find women are so puzzling? =)

Your Thoughts on the PUA Summit

Well, it seemed like enough guys at the LA PUA summit read my blog, so I'm making this post because I'd like it if everyone who was in attendance would post their experiences, thoughts, and comments here about how the Summit went, what the speakers were like, and what kind of adventures everyone got into down here in LA-LA Land.

I look forward to reading what you guys think (even if it's bad stuff). =)

LA PUA Summit 2004

Well, the 2004 Los Angeles Pick-Up Artist Summit was this past weekend here in LA. The proceedings were held in the Project Hollywood Mansion with some of the biggest names in the business present, along with a healthy number of ASFers who came out special for the event.

The Summit technically started on Saturday, but Friday night is when it really started in my opinion. I was over at the mansion for a bit on Friday (I only planned to say a few minutes) and I ended up staying there the whole night and going out to sarge.

The thing that got me hooked was that there were a bunch of guys there that I had never gotten to meet before, and a bunch of good friends that I hadn't seen in a while.

First off, I finally got to meet Formhandle, webmaster of fastseduction.com and babysitter of mASF. I can say that Formhandle is a very cool guy in person. Very chill, laid back, smart, fun to talk to, and just all around nice guy. I sarged with him a little that Friday evening, and it was interesting to see how different our styles were. He's much more subtle and under the radar, I'm more aggressive and overt. Always a good match in a winging situation, lol.

I also got to meet the incomparable Jlaix for the first time in person, fresh from his resurrection from his recent auto-erotic asphyxiation death on April 1st. He seemed to be chipper and in good spirits. I had known Jlaix through his posts on mASF and Mystery's Lounge, but he was very different from what I expected. He was an aloof, cool guy, who was actually very laid back. Not the drunken monster most people flame him to be. Jlaix told me he's trying to be a "kinder, gentler Jlaix" after being put on probation at his favorite club after too aggressively AMOGing obstacles. But man, is he good with the AMOGs. I also got to see a bit of his game that night. VERY tight. VERY solid. He equates inner game with alcohol, which is pretty much the way the majority of people see it, lol.

Got to meet Wilder for the first time. Nice guy. We got to talk a bit about Opening since I wrote a book on the subject and he teaches it at is workshops in San Fran. He's also written a few posts on the subject recently on mASF.

Met Pheromone for the first time as well. Cool guy. Not yet 21, but very alpha. Enjoyed talking to him a great deal.

Got to hang out with Christophe, whom I hadn't seen since Chicago. It was fun to see him again, as I always have a good time with that kookie Frenchman.

Friday night, everyone went out sarging. A big group of us went down to the Saddle Ranch on Sunset Blvd. where Christophe, Herbal, and I ended up venue changing this 3-set of German girls to Mel's Diner and then pulling them back to the PH mansion. Herbal kissed his girl a bit, but other than that, we just got solid number closes. A fun night all in all.

I miss Saturday due to other commitments, but I heard that Formhandle was the first speaker at teh summit, where he discussed PAIMAI and Body Language techniques.

Then, TheOne came out and did impressions of all the big Pick-Up Artist guys, including Mystery, Style, Tyler, Papa, Swinggcat, etc. Apparently, it was hilarious, and had everyone cracking up.

Jlaix spoke for a bit, I think it might have been about AMOGs, but I can't remember.

Playboy was supposed to speak, but I didn't hear anything about him, so I don't know if he did or not.

Tyler spoke for a bit, but he apparently kept getting interrupted by Mystery during his presentation. It got to the point where Mystery basically took over the presentation (which Tyler didn't seem to mind since he was scheduled to speak for three hours)

Saturday ended with MINE'99 doing a mini-seminar about how his stuff teaches things the other systems don't and how to do psychic influence and yoga techniques to improve your inner game.

Come Sunday, it's time for me to speak. It was daylight savings the night before, so we all lost an hour, which messed up the schedule a bit, so Day 2 of the Summit started late.

I had spent the night before preparing an outline for what I was going to talk about, because I didn't want to ramble and bore my audience. I talked a bit about my background and how I got into the game, along with my experiences learing to approach at the Mystery Method Workshop I took back in July. I then went on to discuss approaching further, along with the theory behind the concept of the "bold move." People seemed to really enjoy my speech, so that made me feel good about myself. =)

Next up was Swinggcat, who did a short presentation of his Qualifying and Challenging stuff. He demonstrated a lot of his routines and stuff, but it was mostly a Q&A session.

Third was Style, who was probably the most interesting speaker of the night. He shared a lot of higher value demonstrations he does, as well as a few routines, including "The 100% Perfect Woman" and the "Evolution Kiss Close." Then, in the coolest feature of the night, Style actually had 5 of his girlfriends show up and critique some of the guys in the audience. While they were doing that, he was gaming them the whole time and playing them off each other for everyone to see, even though the girls didn't know what he was doing. It ended up being the LONGEST presentation of the night, but as time went on all of Style's girls ended up getting rapport with one another. My guess is he planned this out and is going to work on getting some 3-somes out of it, but I could be social roboting on that one.

The night ended with Mystery doing his typical speil, explaining his origin, his Method, and how it works.

One interesting note is that there was some talk about seeing Tyler and BadBoy square off in a pick-up contest of direct vs. indirect approaching. I know one guy in particular was interested in seeing that go down. Will this just escalate the tension between these two? Or will both of them just shrug it off? I can't help but think of Battle of the Titans when this subject is broached.

Overall, I had a blast. It was fun to meet all the guys and hang out with them for a bit. Hopefully others had a good time too. I was pretty nervous about speaking in front of all these guys, but I guess it went over well. I recieved lots of compliments on my website (nice to know you guys are reading!) as well as my speech. Hopefully by the time the Austin oen rolls around, I'll have my skills up to snuff so I'll have more to talk about other than approaching.

So the LA Summit was a success! Can't wait for the next one. If you guys have a chance, get your butt's to the Austin Summit this November! It's worth it.

King of All Naturals

I had an interesting experience this weekend, where I got to meet a guy who I feel deserves the title "King of All Naturals." The guy's name is Dominic, and he has some major game. It's not "Game" in the sense that those who study this stuff know it. Rather, it's game in the sense that he knows how to use what he has to get women. I've heard stories about Dominic "King of All Naturals" from my friends before, but after getting to see him in action, I realized the stories didn't really do him justice.

This guy is quite confident with women, and has a very interesting style which is all his own. It's not overtly agressive in nature, in fact, there's more than a few subtle mind-games he plays, but I don't even think he's aware of it. The other night when I was hanging out with him, there was a point where he was scemeing to pull this girl he was talking to into a bathroom and fucking her right there. He didn't quite pull it off, but he ended up fucking her later in the night, and made plans to fly to Vegas with her the next day. This is a girl he LITERALLY met that night, who's already going to travel with him to a different state. That's pretty tight game.

Anyway, I'll probably talk about him a bit more in the future. It would be hard to completely ignore the "King of All Naturals," after all. =)

Out-Alphaed by Betas?

Man o' man, did I have a crappy night of sarging!

So I'm bored with the Hollywood scene and have been exploring the surrounding areas for cool (or at least different) places to pick up women, and last night I decided to go to the San Fernando Valley for a change of scenery. So I went to a club there that was pretty jumping for a Thursday night.

This place TOTALLY reminded me of clubs I used to go to in college. The girls there were, on average, 6-8s on the looks scale. For the most part, they were all packing a little "junk in the trunk" if you know what I mean. A real change of pace from the model-esque Hollywood types.

So I get a few drinks in me and start approaching set after set. I open one -- BOOM! Crash and burn. No energy at all. I open another -- BOOM! Same thing. After about five or six sets, I'm noticing a pattern. I can't understand what the hell is wrong with these interactions, because I'm using pretty good field tested material that I KNOW works. But for some reason, I'm failing to hook the girls.

Upon talking with a friend of mine after the club closes, I began to realize what happened. Every single guy in that club was a Beta. They were so Beta, in fact, that the only approaching being done was by women. They'd choose which guys they liked and then they would approach the men and start flirting. I saw this happen numerous times, but it didn't click with me until afterwards. However, when I was going into set and controlling the interaction, the girls would get uncomfortable -- because I wasn't being Beta. It's almost as if the very ACT of approaching raised my value so high I blew myself out.

This is mind boggling to me, and I'm curious if other guys have had similar experiences. Granted, my material is not the strongest stuff in the world, but I can usually get into a set by using it. The fact that the very act of approaching would blow me out is such a foriegn concept to me -- I mean, I wouldn't even GET to most of my material because the sets would stall out so quickly.

I've noticed similar episodes occur whenever I'd sarge outside of LA. Places like Washington D.C., Pennsylvania, and Chicago were very much like this club I was in tonight, and it dawned on me that this is very much the way "normal" people hook up. My perspective gets so skewed going into Hollywood and hitting on a crowd that's used to a certain atmosphere and certain stimuli, that I forget there is a whole other world out there with different perceptions on how things work.

I'm often reminded of a conversation I had with Tyler D. up in Chicago when I was bitching about the "cliquiness" of the women up there, and he simply told me "Dude, EVERYPLACE except New York and LA is like this. You Hollywood guys are fuckin' SPOILED, yo!"

I guess tonight proved him right.

Getting Frustrated

You guys remember that commercial, the one where the mother and the daughter are walking down the beach, the surf crashing up against their bare feet, and the daughter turns to her mom and says:

"You ever have that... not-so-fresh feeling?"

Well, all vaginas aside, I'm beginning to have that feeling. I've been going out in the field constantly lately, and I think it's wearing on me. My energy is way down. I'm a bit depressed because I feel like I've hit a plateau. I'm thinking I may be pushing things a bit too hard and trying to force things to happen when a re-direction of my energies might be more appropriate, especially now as my personal financial situation becomes more dire. Living in LA is expensive, but living AND sarging in LA has it's costs. Those cover fees, parking fees, late night meals, and the occasional drink all start to add up. =(

If there's one thing I've come to realize in my experiences, it's that the learning curve has it's peaks and valleys. Both are necessary. But I think the higher the peak, the lower the valley, and I've hit some pretty high peaks lately.

What do you guys do when you go through this? Do you just take a break from sarging entirely? I'd be hesitant to do that because sarging is very much like working out in the gym. If you stop workinging out, your muscles deteriorate, and it's harder to start up working out again. I don't want my skills to atrophy, but I can't keep going at this pace for much longer or I'll burn out. I guess I can cut back a bit, but if I do, I feel like I'll just continue to spin my wheels.

It sucks, I know. It'll pass, I know. Maybe I just need to move to Bolivia for a month and spend my days with $6 whores and $0.24 beers to relieve some steam.

Anti-Dump's Machine

While skimming through the DJ forums, I found a post that quoted someone by the name of Anti-Dump which I found interesting.

Anti-Dump writes:
You follow the same procedure time and time again with ALL women.

This will almost guarantee you success finding an INTERESTED women because it is like having a love machine. Just push a button and there she is...well there is more work than that but you get the picture.

You are now on the Road to 'The One'.

What he's basically saying here is, if you have a structure you use when approaching women, you will get results consistent with that structure. So in essence, you are creating a machine which will produce the same outcome time and time again. This is interesting because it's been something I have been experiementing with for some time.

If you look at someone like Mystery, for example, Mystery has a concrete structure he follows when he's out picking up women. This structure is pretty much embodied in Mystery Method. I think Tyler has a similar structure. I know Swinggcat has his own structure based on his method of seduction. All three of these guys are very successful with women, I think partly because they've found a structure that gives them consistent results, and they are able to not only REPEAT that structure, but TEACH that structure.

As I've been getting out in the field more and more and practicing my skills with women, I've found there are certain things I do that get good results on a consistent basis, and when I have used those things in tandum with each other, the results I get are not only consistent, but powerful. I am now currently working on creating a structure for myself that I'll be able to follow time and time again with women. I think this is an important thing to do because when you have a structure, a game plan, you eliminate a great deal of uncertaintany in the interaction. When you already know what you're going to say and what kind of responses you're going to get, you're brain is able to focus on other things, such as visual cues the girl gives you, or the ability to think of how you're going to adjust your structure depending on outside forces, such as AMOGs and other obstacles.

I think that this is one of my biggest criticisms of SS. Back when I first got into it, all you had to do was memorize pattern after pattern and throw it at the girl. You didn't really have to think about what to say, it was just: Shining Example --> IC pattern --> Fascination pattern --> Discovery Channel --> Blowjob pattern. When the system was adjusted and you got into asking questions and trying to pattern on the fly, that's where I think people started seeing diminishing returns on results.

The same thing can be said for Double Your Dating. Though I like what David D. has to share, the fact is it's a behavioral theory. Cocky and Funny does not give you a structure, it's more of an internal shift you ahve to make to get a social attitude. You still gotta think about what you're going to say to the girl, and it relies very much on how interesting of a human being you are (which for some guys is the kiss of death).

What I like about Mystery Method is that when it's broken down for you, you're told "Okay, you open with this, throw down this neg if she's an 8 and these negs if she's a 10, run this routine, then this routine, then isolate, run this routine, get the kiss close, get the number close, set up the bridge." Boom-boom-boom. It's the same, every time, with every girl. You begin to know the common objections that come up, and you adjust your material accordingly. And before long, you have a game plan, a machine that is going to spit out consistent results.

And in the end, isn't that what we all want?

Sex After the 3rd Date

Sexkitten has an interesting post about when women are expected to put out.

Sexkitten writes:
Sex After The 3rd Date -- Is what men expect, a man told me last night. Sure enough it was our third date, and you got it, he thought it was time to have sex. I told him it wasn't going to happen. I had no idea that there was a rule. I've dated men for a month and longer and not give them any sex. If I'm not feeling a man, he’s not getting any. I don't care if it's our twentieth date.

And evidently, women who have sex before the third date are whores. Where can I find the rule book on this stuff? I’ve never had sex with a man on the first or second date, or third date, but that’s because I didn’t feel it. I have trust issues, and fear of sleeping with someone who have a wife or girlfriend that they’re not telling me about. But what if I have sex with a man whom I connect with on a second date? Does that mean I’m a whore? What if the mood was right? I say screw the rules on both account.

You know, it's funny. This is why I hate dating. I've been in situations where I've dated girls for weeks or months without sex. It is the most frustrating thing in the world! I have my differences with MINE'99, but one thing he taught back in his '98 Home Study Course is that dating is for women you are already sleeping with!

Indeed, this is the mantra for most guys in the Pick-Up community. If a girl doesn't put out, we've learned not to date her. We look at guys who date women they haven't slept with as complete Average Frustrated Chumps (AFCs, another MINE'99 invention). It's funny, because the whole idea of dating a girl more than 3 times without getting any is so foreign to me now, I just have to laugh at the notion.

I don't personally look down on a woman if she puts out right away or very quickly after meeting. Mystery Method is set up to get a girl to have sex with you 7 hours after you meet. The whole purpose of studying this stuff is getting girls into bed as FAST as possible! I think guys who look down at women or resent them for sleeping with them so quickly have a fuckin' screw loose. I guess it's a trust thing, where they may think that if a girl sleeps with them quickly, they've either slept with a bunch of other guys or will cheat on them very easily. Meanwhile, they're all about sticking their dick in the next moist hole they can find. Hypocricy at it's best.

The reason I like the idea of only dating women you're sleeping with is because it really opens the door for great relationships. I think if a guy dates a woman for an extended period of time without sleeping with the girl, his self-esteem suffers and the woman he's with won't respect him -- be it as a man or a sexual creature. Once sex is established, it gives the guy great latitude in developing a strong relationship with the woman.

Being Friends before Dating

Okay, this is the age old question every guy has struggled with since some poor schmoe invented the whole concept of "courting." And that is, do you want to befriend a girl before you start dating her?

Fezz on the Don Juan Discussion Forum writes...

Fezz writes:
so guys, what do you think about being friends before dating???

Two friends of mine that are girls were best friends with their boyfriends before they started dating. They both told me they built up alot of trust in each other before they dated their men since they were good friends with them. the relationships for both of them have lasted quite long also. What do you all think about this?? I think its a little awkward when I date a person I have been friends with. It almost goes against the teachings of the site in a way, but I have noticed it has worked in many cases for my friends. Do you think that with some people, even if you are in "the friends zone" that there is a good possibility to hook up, or do you all think it is stupid to date someone you arent good friends with, and that it is always best to date someone you dont really know that well?

You can read the whole thread here.

Now, I've been in PLENTY of situations where I was friends with a girl I wanted to date. In fact, that used to be my M.O. I'd befriend a girl before trying to get them into a romantic relationship. The only problem is, this tactic never worked for me. Ever. Either the act of befriending the girl killed any attraction she had for me because I became so supplicative, or there was no attraction with the girl to begin with and I wouldn't be able to move out of the "friend" zone.

But I do know guys for which this tactic DOES work. And I think the difference between the guys this method works for and the guys it doesn't is how the "friendship" part of it is handled. If you become a girl's emotional tampon, like, the type of guy that she talks to about her problems, the type of guy who's "there for her," that she can always "depend on," before you introduce sexuality into the dynamic, you're screwed.

The guys this usually works for are pretty good at keeping some type of sexual tension in the relationship. They create value for themselves, are aloof, spontaneous, adventurous, and most of all -- FUN! They don't concern themselves with the "therapist" role so many guys fall into with girls, so there's always that underlying hint of sexuality when dealing with their girl "friends."

What we do when we learn to be "Pick-Up Artists" is we learn how to quickly create sexual tension and exploit it so we can hyperdrive into getting sexual with a woman. Once the sex is established, friendship can be instituted for the long game of LTR (Long Term Relationship). I think this is valuable for most AFCs to learn, because a lot of guys just don't know how to bring their sexuality into an interaction with a woman. It's also a much faster method of getting a girl than the "befriending" tactic.

I'd be interested to hear from people who typically go down this road of making friends with the girl and then moving into sex. Actually, I'd be even MORE interested in hearing from guys who've been pegged as friends, and successfully moved out of that into having a sexual relationship with the girl. Though I doubt there are many guys out there who have been successful in this respect.

No Authorities

Epitomy of Evolution wrote an interesting little rant on the General board of mASF.

epitomy_of_evolution writes:
Are no authorities in the way of seduction. TD, gunwitch, ijjjji, harmless, etc. are not the final say on getting laid. One thing if guys on here look to them for some help in the way of getting laid. Another when guys give themselves up and live the life of another poster here.

Anyone who gets good does it on their own. I smell a wise ass about to give me an exception. Fuck off.

They don't rely on anyone else. Maybe get some help, but the rest is willpower. You aren't getting laid, it's because you aren't taking action and doing anything about it. DOn't go reading up posts if you can't just get out and try to get laid. Do it. You can't do this, no one else will help you any.

You can't get out there and try to get laid on your own, all the way, I say fuck you. Start doing it. You can't do this, fuck off and die now becuase if ya can't take charge of your life, maybe you can at least take charge of your death.

To continue with the Neo-Rio love of the day, here is his response...

Neo-Rio writes:
One of the main lessons to learn in this game is that, although many people espouse various tricks and techniques and theory... AT THE END OF THE DAY you have to have COMPLETE confidence in what you are doing.

Admittedly, that's a hard frame for the newbie to understand when he's got all these guru's ideas about attraction and seduction floating in his head.

I think there's a lot of truth in this. It's a very Zen Bhuddist outlook where guys who get good at this basically have to "kill their teacher," so to speak, and develop their own take on their style. Of course, the only real way to do this is by going out in the field and practicing on a regular basis.

Hanging out with Tyler Durden is an interesting experience because he is CONSTANTLY going out in the field and testing new material while refining old ones. It's funny, because as much flack as he gets for being an "immitator," Tyler very much does his own thing which is different from those who taught him. I'm going through something very similar at the moment where I am slowly starting to develop my own style and take on Pick-Up. It's a slow, painful process (in more ways than one), but one that is necessary.

And I agree with Neo-Rio where at the end of the day, it all comes down to confidence. But I'd go even further and say it's about CONGRUENCE as well. Not only do you have to be sure in what you're doing, but you gotta be consistent with it in all aspects of your life. I mean, you can ACT alpha in a club, but if you aren't alpha in how you move through life, any girl you end up attracting is gonna see through your shenanigans.

You can read the whole thread here.

The 2 1/2" Syndrome

Sexkitten put up an interesting post on male genitalia. And you know me, if it's about male genitalia, I'm gonna post about it!!!! =)

Sexkitten writes
Every time I open my email these days, I see ads for men to have penis enlargement surgery. And yep, we women may have to take some of the blame. (Do we make our men feel inadequate? Do we really think that bigger is better? I’ll address that later in another blog)

This is a sensitive issue for men, and many may be tempted, but it’s a BAD idea, folks. I KNOW! I had a boyfriend who did it. He actually had three surgeries in one year. One wasn’t enough, twice, three times, he’s still not satisfied. Will he ever be satisfied? I doubt it. The problem is not his penis size. He’s sick in the head, I believe. And should have used that money to get psychological help.

The procedure is not only expensive—it’s painful, and very risky. Yes, you run the risk of not being able to reach a full erection. And that’s not the worst part, you could become impotent!!! And eventually, you’ll be back to having the same old boy you had—and don’t get me started about the scars left on your behind where the fat was taken to be inserted into the penis.

And mentally you will be constantly worrying that something my have gone wrong—so wrong that even though you may be physically fine, you can’t stop worrying, which can affect you performing sexually.

Another interesting piece of information: the majority of men who gets this operation DO NOT need it. They are average size or bigger. I would suggest getting some professional help before taking this step.

Dick size is definitely a big issue for a lot of guys. I rang in with my thoughts in the comment section of Sexkitten's blog if you guys care to read it. You can find the thread here.

Boobgate

**Reposted from the first Lair, original date: 2/3/04

So we got to see some boobies on network television this weekend. I didn't even notice it when it happened, because at the time I was busy eating some good old fashioned Texas BBQ at Roadking's place, along with Swinggcat, Adam the Natural, and a few exotic dancer friends of ours. It wasn't until Mystery came over and forced Roadking to put his TiVo to good use that we got to see the whole pathetic event play out.

Frankly, I don't see what the big deal is. You see much worse past 10:00 pm on Cinemax. We were all sitting around the TV watching Justin Timberlake rip the boddice off as Janet's honkin' hunk o' skin flap bobbled out for a good 2.3 seconds of air time. It went so fast we were all like ''Huh?'' It looked to me like she was wearing a pasti, so no one really gave it a second thought.

Here’s the facts as I see them: Janet, in a bid to out Madonna-and-Britney Madonna and Britney in light of her new album coming out this March, either orchestrates or agrees to a little so-called indecent exposure. Mr. Timberlake, eager to shed his own squeaky clean image, and one up his ex, is either put up for or volunteers to be the bodice ripper. And CBS, worried about a lack-luster superbowl with 2 teams no one really cares about, agrees in order to stir up interest. So off they go on their merry little way, do their performance, and – dear God! – dare to show tit, which most kids become intimately familiar with as babies, and nipple, which dominates daytime television with the vast amount of shirtless bohunks that rule the soaps.

Now I hear that the FCC is doing an investigation into the incident, that CBS ''didn't know'' (they obviously did), and that parent's across the country are outraged that their little kids were exposed to prime-time boobage.

It's no wonder Europeans laugh at us when it comes to sex.

And it's no wonder why the seduction community is such a necessary entity in this world. I really fucking hate the fact that there are probably untold numbers of little boys out there who saw this on TV, and their parents are making them feel guilty for seeing it, saying things like ''You shouldn't have seen that,'' or ''It's a bad, dirty, naughty thing you saw!'' Even worse, I feel for the untold number of little girls who are made to feel bad about having boobs. Who know's how many parents called Janet Jackson a slut or accused her of causing society's downfall. It's no wonder we, as Americans, are so fucked up about sexuality with shit like this going down.

If anything, there should be more boobs on TV. Sex shouldn't be a bad thing to expose kids to. It's probably one of the greatest things someone can experience in this world, so why are we made to feel bad about it? Why is it such an outrage? This whole culture is fucked up bass-ackwards when it comes to sex, IMO.

If you ask me, the real outrage was P. Ditty's butchering of the Toni Basil classic ''Hey Mickey.'' Am I the only one who cares about the sanctity of 80's pop music?

Thundercat

PS: I was able to catch both the Surreal Life and Survivor after the Superbowl. Both shows have a lot to teach about persuasion, influence, and how to deal with women. Next time they're on, pay attention to how Richard Hatch handles himself in Survivor, and how Ron Jeremy deals with women in the Surreal Life. Both are great. =)